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美国网友热议:为什么有那么多难民要到美国去?

俄乌冲突爆发后,美国一边不断向乌克兰输送武器,为冲突持续推波助澜,一边给乌克兰“画大饼”,信誓旦旦地承诺要接收10万乌克兰难民。但当几千名乌克兰难民经过千难万险、穿过美墨边境进入美国后,美国在3月份却只接受了12人的难民申请。美国经常以民主和人权捍卫者自居,对“美国梦”津津乐道,每年发布《国别人权报告》,站在道德高地对其他国家的人权状况指指点点,却对自身的诸多人权问题视而不见,而移民与难民权利被严重侵犯就是美国糟糕的人权状况的缩影。在美版知乎Quora上,美国网友提问道:为什么全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?这个问题引起各国专家网友的围观和热议,美国人反对,许多专家认为美国是始作俑者应该担责,我们看看他们的观点。

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

问题:美国怎样才能接纳难民?

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

问题:美国英国接纳叙利亚难民吗?

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

美国联邦政府雇员凯特尔•莫瑞的回答

According to the constitution of the United States, the purpose of the United States federal government (usfg) is very simple: the American people, in order to become a more perfect union, establish social justice, ensure domestic peace, provide common defense, promote universal welfare, and ensure that we and our children enjoy the blessings of freedom.

根据美国宪法,美国联邦政府(USFG)组建的目的非常简单:美国人民,为了结合成为更加完美的联邦,建立社会正义,确保国内安宁,提供共同防御,促进普遍福利,并确保我们自己和子孙后代享有自由的祝福。

Obviously, the purpose of the federal government is to promote the general welfare of its citizens, not that of the world or foreign citizens.

显然,联邦政府存在的目的是促进其公民的普遍福利,而不是促进世界或外国公民的普遍福利。

In this regard, the United States has no moral obligation to provide citizenship to foreign citizens seeking asylum. In addition, since the number of immigrants per year is limited in law and practice, the federal government (usfg) should only provide citizenship to those who can best improve the "overall welfare" of the country.

在这方面,美国没有向寻求庇护的外国公民提供公民身份的道德义务。此外,由于每年的移民数量在法律上和实践上都是有限的,因此联邦政府(USFG)应该只向那些最能改善本国“总体福利”的人提供公民身份。

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

If usfg promises to accept a certain number of refugees without considering their contribution ability, it refuses more qualified immigrants, thus putting the interests of Syrians above its own interests. Do you think Americans will allow this?

如果承诺接受一定数量的难民,而不考虑他们的贡献能力,USFG联邦政府拒绝了更合格的移民入境,从而将叙利亚人的利益置于自身利益之上,你觉得美国人会允许这样做吗?

This does not mean that Syrian refugees are unproductive. The reason is that the policy of accepting immigrants purely as refugees inevitably ignores their ability to improve the overall welfare of the country. Therefore, the policy of accepting refugees should not be pursued indefinitely.

这并不是说叙利亚难民没有生产力,理由只是,纯粹以难民身份接受移民的政策必然忽视他们改善国家总体福利的能力,因此不应无限推行接收难民的政策。

A generally accepted free market principle is that demand does not give anyone any rights. Just because you are hungry does not mean that you should get food, and no one has the obligation to provide you with food and clothing. Similarly, this does not mean that the United States should give them citizenship, because doing so conflicts with its own interests.

一个普遍接受的自由市场原则是,需求并没有赋予任何人任何权利,仅仅因为你饿了并不意味着你就应该得到食物,没有人有义务供你吃穿,同样,这并不意味着美国应该给予他们公民身份,因为这样做与美国自身的利益相冲突。

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

Although the United States has a vast territory and rich resources, Syrian refugees have enough living space. However, their arrival will certainly result in the crowding out of resources. I think the US federal government should not put the interests of foreign citizens above the interests of its own citizens.

我们美国虽然幅员辽阔,资源丰富,叙利亚难民有足够的生存空间。然而,他们的来到一定会造成资源的挤占,我认为美国联邦政府不应该将外国公民的利益置于本国公民利益之上。

In addition, we have to consider security issues. The vast majority of Syrian refugees' identity cards and passports are forged. There is no database to investigate their background. Terrorist infiltration is real.

此外,我们不得不考虑安全问题。绝大多数叙利亚难民身份证和护照都是伪造的,根本没有数据库来对他们进行背景调查,恐怖主义渗透是真实存在的。

We do not know how many jihadis there are among the refugees. A small group of people is enough to make a country pay a heavy price. The Paris attack in november2015 was carried out by nine attackers.

我们不知道难民中有多少圣战者,一小撮人足以令一个国家付出惨痛的代价,2015年11月巴黎袭击事件就是由9名袭击者实施。

There are more refugees supporting terrorism than you think. Immigration has not changed their views on domestic politics. Look at those Irish Americans who support the IRA. They have never set foot in Ireland for generations, but are so enthusiastic about splitting Britain. (the Irish Republican Army, founded in 1919 and adapted from the nationalist military organization "Irish Volunteers", which aims to establish an independent Republic of Ireland, fought with the British troops stationed in Ireland and realized political demands through violent activities for a long time. It is regarded by many countries as a terrorist organization. It once fought for the independence of Ireland and now for the reunification of Northern Ireland.)

支持恐怖主义的难民比你想象的要多,移民并没有改变他们对国内政治的看法,看看那些支持爱尔兰共和军的爱尔兰裔美国人,他们几代人都从未涉足爱尔兰,却对分裂英国如此狂热。(爱尔兰共和军,成立于1919年,由旨在建立独立爱尔兰共和国的民族主义军事组织“爱尔兰义勇军”改编而成,与驻在爱尔兰的英军作战,长时间通过暴力活动实现政治诉求,被许多国家视为恐怖组织。曾为爱尔兰独立、现为统一北爱尔兰而战斗。)

Many terrorist organizations enjoy broad public support in Syria. Isis is only an emerging organization in recent years. Al Qaida, ahrar al sham and Al nusra have received a certain degree of public support among people who want to see and end the Assad regime or Isis.

许多恐怖组织在叙利亚享有广泛的民众支持。ISIS只是近些年比较露头的组织,基地组织、Ahrar Al-Sham、Al-Nusra都在希望看到和结束阿萨德政权或ISIS的人们中得到了一定程度的民众支持。

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

Looking at the rising crime rate and restricted areas in Europe, the vast majority of refugees do not want to integrate into European culture, although the modern welfare state provides them with a better standard of living than working in the old country.

看看欧洲不断上升的犯罪率和禁区,绝大多数难民并不想融入欧洲文化,尽管现代福利国家为他们提供了比在旧国家工作更好的生活水平。

This is an unsolvable problem caused by the stupidity of politicians. The new western response to civil war and terrorist insurgency is to open the border, but it sounds like a victory for terrorists: destroy the west through financial and social means, regularly launch attacks from the refugee population, and recruit local citizens of the host country to participate in the terrorist war. All Europeans are paying for populist political correctness.

这是一个因为政客愚蠢造成的,无法解决的问题。西方对内战和恐怖叛乱的新对策是开放边界,可这听起来像是恐怖分子的胜利:通过金融和社会手段破坏西方,定期从难民人口中发动袭击,并在当地招募东道国公民参加恐怖主义战争。全体欧洲人正在为民粹的政治正确买单。

So what does the turmoil in these countries have to do with us? Why should we be held responsible for their stupidity?

所以,这些国家的动乱又和我们有什么关系呢?我们凭什么要为他们的愚蠢承担责任?


美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

德国网友马特•查诺夫的回答

I believe that most people in most countries in the world agree that the United States is the most important threat to world peace, and its threat mainly stems from its unparalleled military strength:

我认为,世界上大多数国家的大多数人都认可,美国是对世界和平最主要的威胁,而其威胁主要源于其无与伦比的军事实力:

It has passed the Patriot Act, which gives the US government the power to buckle its hat and launch war in the name of preventing future terrorist acts, while enjoying the power to comprehensively supervise and investigate its citizens. This includes some completely absurd measures, such as requiring me to list my income, assets and savings when applying for life insurance. What does this have to do with preventing terrorism?

它通过了《爱国者法案》,赋予美国政府以防止未来恐怖主义行为的名义,四处扣帽子,发动战争的权力,同时享有全面监督和调查其公民的权力。这包括一些完全荒谬的措施,比如要求我在入境美国后申请人寿保险时列出我的收入、资产和储蓄,这与防止恐怖主义有什么关系?

The invasion of Iraq without any reason resulted in 140000 deaths, and millions more died due to the destruction of water sources and the shortage of food and sanitary supplies. All Iraqi government employees were dismissed, pro american factions were brought to power, and an attempt was made to permanently lock the oil supply to the United States in the "Iraqi constitution". After the war, no security guarantee was provided, and the whole country fell into chaos.

无缘无故入侵伊拉克,造成14万人死亡,另有数百万人因水源破坏、食品和卫生用品短缺而死亡,解雇了伊拉克所有的政府雇员,将亲美派扶植上台,试图将对美石油供应永久锁定在“伊拉克宪法”中,在战争结束后没有提供任何安全保障,并使整个国家陷入混乱。

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

The United States invaded Iraq under the pretext that saddamhussein possessed weapons of mass destruction. After the invasion, saddamhussein was arrested and hanged, and thousands of innocent Iraqis were killed. In the end, no weapons of mass destruction were found. President Bush was not tried for lying to the world, nor was he imprisoned for plunging the country into chaos. He and his successor still sit in the White House and give orders to the world.

美国以萨达姆·侯赛因拥有大规模杀伤性武器为借口入侵伊拉克,入侵后,萨达姆被捕并被绞死,数千名无辜的伊拉克人被杀害,最后却没有发现大规模杀伤性武器,布什总统并没有因为对世界撒谎而受到审判,也没有因为让这个国家陷入混乱而坐牢,他和他的继任者仍端坐在白宫对世界发号施令。

The United States and its NATO allies invaded Libya and overthrew Muammar Gaddafi. Muammar Gaddafi was accused of killing Pro democracy protesters. Just as we waited for the "Pro democracy protesters" who killed Gaddafi on behalf of the United States to take over power, Libya erupted in civil war, and the flag of Isis soon began to surface.

美国及其北约盟国入侵利比亚,推翻穆阿迈尔·卡扎菲,穆阿迈尔·卡扎菲被控杀害亲民主抗议者,就在我们等待美国代表他们杀死卡扎菲的“亲民主抗议者”接管政权的时候,利比亚爆发了内战,Isis的旗帜很快开始浮出水面。

Libya under Gaddafi is like this:

而卡扎菲统治下的利比亚是这样的:

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?
美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

Now is the scene after he was bombed by the United States and its NATO allies:

现在是在他被美国及其北约盟国轰炸之后的场景:

美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?
美国网友:为何全世界的难民都想到美国来?美国应该接收他们吗?

Here are some facts you may not know about Libya under Muammar Gaddafi:

关于穆阿迈尔·卡扎菲(Muammar Gaddafi)领导下的利比亚,以下是一些你可能不知道的事实:

• electricity in Libya is free... For all citizens;

•利比亚用电是免费的……对所有公民都是免费的;

• the loan has no interest. The Libyan banks are state-owned. According to the law, the interest rate for loans to all citizens is 0%;

•贷款没有利息,利比亚的银行是国有的,根据法律规定,贷款给所有公民的利率均为0%;

• if a Libyan cannot find a job after graduation, the state will pay the average wage of the industry in which he or she will participate, as if he or she were employed, until he or she finds a job;

•如果利比亚人毕业后无法找到工作,国家将支付其将要参与行业的平均工资,就像他或她被雇用一样,直到找到工作为止;

• if Libyans want to engage in agriculture, they will get farmland, houses, equipment, seeds and livestock to start their farm construction - all free of charge;

•如果利比亚人想从事农业事业,他们会得到农田、房子、设备、种子和牲畜,以启动他们的农场建设——这一切都是免费的;

• Gaddafi implemented the world's largest irrigation project, known as the "great man-made river project", so that water is no longer short and easy to use in this desert country;

•卡扎菲实施了世界上最大的灌溉项目,称为“伟大的人工河流项目”,以使水在这个沙漠国家不再短缺而且使用便利;

• in Libya, housing is considered a basic human right. (Gaddafi wrote in his green book: "houses are the basic needs of individuals and families.")

•在利比亚,拥有住房被视为一项基本人权。(卡扎菲的绿皮书中写道:“房子是个人和家庭的基本需要。”)

• the Libyan government will provide 60000 dinars (50000 US dollars) to all newly married couples to purchase their first apartment to help them form a family;

•利比亚政府将向所有新婚夫妇提供60000第纳尔(50000美元)的补贴,用于购买他们的第一套公寓,以帮助他们组建家庭;

• a portion of Libyan oil sales proceeds is credited directly to the bank accounts of all Libyan citizens;

•利比亚石油销售收入的一部分直接记入所有利比亚公民的银行账户;

• mothers who have children will receive a $5000 reward;

•生育子女的母亲将获得5000美元奖励;

• when Libyans buy cars, the government will subsidize 50% of the car price;

•当利比亚人购买汽车时,政府将补贴汽车价格的50%;

• the price of gasoline in Libya is US $0.14 per litre;

•利比亚的汽油价格为每升0.14美元;

• every libidian can buy 40 loaves of bread for only $0.15;

•每名利比亚当地人只需0.15美元,就可以购买40条面包;

• education and medical care in Libya are free. Libya can boast that it is one of the best medical systems in the Arab and African world. All people have free access to doctors, hospitals, clinics and medicines;

•利比亚的教育和医疗都是免费的,利比亚可以夸耀自己是阿拉伯和非洲世界最好的医疗体系之一,所有人都可以免费获得医生、医院、诊所和药品;

• if Libyans cannot find the necessary education or medical facilities in Libya, the government will support them to go abroad - not only free, but also they can receive US $2300 per month in accommodation and car allowance;

•如果利比亚人在利比亚找不到所需的教育或医疗设施,政府将资助他们出国——不仅免费,而且他们每月可以获得2300美元的住宿和汽车津贴;

• 25% of Libyans have university degrees. Before Gaddafi, only 25% of Libyans were literate. Today, the figure is 87%;

•25%的利比亚人拥有大学学位,在卡扎菲之前,只有25%的利比亚人识字,今天这个数字是87%;

• Libya has no external debt and its foreign exchange reserves amount to $150billion - although most of them are now frozen globally.

•利比亚没有外债,其外汇储备达1500亿美元——尽管其中大部分现已被全球冻结。

In addition, don't forget what happened in Syria. When a group of protesters tried to overthrow the Assad government and realize their Arab Spring plan, the United States quickly sent a large number of weapons to deal with President Assad.

另外,别忘了叙利亚发生过的事情,当一群抗议者试图推翻阿萨德政府实现他们的阿拉伯之春计划时,很快美国就雪中送炭,连忙送来大量武器来对付阿萨德总统。

The decision of the United States to send weapons to Syria repeats a historic mistake. Syria is currently experiencing endless violence, and hundreds of thousands of innocent people have died. If it were not for the intervention of China and Russia, more lives would be ruined.

美国向叙利亚发送武器的决定重复了一个历史性错误,叙利亚目前正经历无休止的暴力,数十万无辜者死亡,如果不是中国和俄罗斯的干预,会有更多的生灵涂炭。

Now I want to ask the Americans, do you still think that the displaced refugees have nothing to do with you? Shouldn't the US government be held responsible for these deep crimes?

现在我要问问美国人,你们还觉得流离失所的难民和你们一点都没有关系吗?美国政府不应该为这些深重的罪孽负责吗?

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